The TORBEN CONTROVERSY - Andrew Strom - COMMENTS?

#1 · March 9, 2016, 3:30 am

Quote from Forum Archives on March 9, 2016, 3:30 am
Posted by: prophetic <prophetic@...>

The TORBEN CONTROVERSY - COMMENTS?
by Andrew Strom

I hope by now you have seen the movie "The Last Reformation"
by my old friend Torben Sondergaard. (If not, there is a link at the
end of this article). Of course, the movie is very powerful and
inspiring - which is why we have promoted it. It literally changes
people's lives.

But there are always those who have concerns - and it is often
the same things that come up over and over. So I am writing this
article to address some of these things.

Firstly, I am not a member of 'The Last Reformation' movement.
To me, this is not about a man or a movement. It is all about
JESUS and what He wants to do in the earth. We can take the
very best stuff that Torben puts out and combine it with the things
God has shown us - and see tremendous powerful things happen
in people's lives. That is because it is not about us and it is not
about Torben. It is all about JESUS and what He wants to do.

EXPERIENCED a DAY OF MIRACLES

If you have been on this email list for awhile, you will know that
we have been doing similar things to the movie for years. Praying
and baptizing people on the streets, etc. But I have to admit, when
I got back from the recent "Kickstart" with Torben in Australia,
something in me felt new and different. It was like a 'jump' had
taken place so that healings and other powerful things suddenly
felt more 'normal' and more attainable. And now we are teaching
others and they are seeing this "jump" take place in their own
lives. A jump into Book-of-Acts Christianity.

We just returned from a little town in Northland where some
brothers and I held a Training Weekend not too different from the
ones Torben holds. On Saturday we literally had an entire day
of healings, people getting filled with the Spirit and speaking in
'tongues', baptisms in the ocean - all interspersed with teaching
on the "Foundations" (Hebrews 6) - and so-on.

At one point we got all the "well" people to pray for all those with
injuries and sickness. Many were instantly healed. While this
was going on, I started praying for a woman who had had two
operations on her hips and walked in constant pain. As I
commanded healing in the name of JESUS she was instantly
healed and took off walking up and down the aisle to check that
the pain was gone. Totally healed in Jesus' name! I then asked
her if she had ever been filled with the Holy Spirit and spoken in
'tongues'. She never had. I laid on hands and prayed for her. She
was instantly filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in
a beautiful prayer-language. Honestly, I have never seen a person
look more radiant or filled-with-joy than this lady. And two hours
later she was helping to baptize a friend in the ocean. Real New
Testament stuff happening right before our eyes.

Did it used to be common for me to see powerful things happen
instantaneously like that? Nope. But now it is starting to become
truly "normal". And we also find that we are able to pass this on
to others. The gospel is being followed by healings and miracles,
just like it was in the Bible.

BAPTISM is AN ISSUE

Personally I have always been strong on baptism - both in water
and in the Spirit. The thing that I am strongest on is that baptism
should be done in FAITH. You need to BELIEVE that in baptism
God will do all the things He says He will do. Of course we insist
that people must repent first before they are baptized.

So when the Bible speaks of baptism as a "death and burial" of
the old life (Rom 6:3-4) we tell people to believe God for that. And
when it says that baptism is a "cutting off" (Col 2:11-12) and a
"washing away" (Acts 22:16) we tell people to believe God for
that. This makes baptism very powerful - just as it should be. Why
do we treat baptism as a mere "symbol" when if we do it in FAITH
it can be one of the most powerful spiritual experiences of a
person's entire life?

A lot of people ask questions about the way Torben baptizes.
You will notice in the movie that he says to the person, "I baptize
you into Jesus Christ" (or in the "name of Jesus Christ") but then
he does something additional while he is putting them under the
water. He says, "Die with Christ, rise with Christ." And he does
it every time. In fact, a lot of people get the impression that this
is Torben's baptismal formula. "Die with Christ, rise with Christ."

If you ask him, I'm sure Torben will say that this is just something
he adds to emphasize what baptism is all about. (Rom 6:3-4).
But the problem is that Torben's followers around the world are
copying him in a way that makes it seem like this is now the
proper "formula" for baptism. This could really cause problems.
In fact, it already is.

For many years I have personally baptized people "in the name
of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit - in the name of Jesus
Christ." Why do I do it this way? Because in Matt 28:19 it tells
us to baptize in the name of the "Father, Son and Holy Spirit"
but in the Book of Acts it tells us they baptized people in the
"name of Jesus Christ". So to fulfill all these Scriptures and also
to save confusion, I make sure that all of this is covered. To
speak the name of Jesus over someone being baptized is a very
wonderful thing.

So I have no problem with Torben baptizing people simply "into
the name of Jesus Christ." Personally I prefer to do it a bit
differently, but I have no problem with that at all. And neither do
I have a problem with people joining the 'Last Reformation'
movement. If they want to do that it is entirely up to them.

As for me and others, however, we consider that we are already
part of the "Jesus" movement. We love to take great material like
the 'Last Reformation' movie and show it to people to make them
inspired about doing the works of Jesus in the earth. It is one of
the best tools I know of to show that a "Book of Acts" lifestyle
truly is possible today. A very powerful film. But we do not have
to be part of a "movement" to do that.

I strongly encourage you to gather your friends and relations to
watch this movie. There is really nothing else like it. Maybe you
can even have a prayer and healing session afterward! Or a
baptism session! I'm sure it will inspire your friends just as it
has inspired many others.

TO COMMENT click here - www.revivalschool.com/

TO WATCH the MOVIE - thelastreformationmovie.com/

God bless you all.

Andrew Strom.

Posted by: prophetic <prophetic@...>

The TORBEN CONTROVERSY - COMMENTS?
by Andrew Strom

I hope by now you have seen the movie "The Last Reformation"
by my old friend Torben Sondergaard. (If not, there is a link at the
end of this article). Of course, the movie is very powerful and
inspiring - which is why we have promoted it. It literally changes
people's lives.

But there are always those who have concerns - and it is often
the same things that come up over and over. So I am writing this
article to address some of these things.

Firstly, I am not a member of 'The Last Reformation' movement.
To me, this is not about a man or a movement. It is all about
JESUS and what He wants to do in the earth. We can take the
very best stuff that Torben puts out and combine it with the things
God has shown us - and see tremendous powerful things happen
in people's lives. That is because it is not about us and it is not
about Torben. It is all about JESUS and what He wants to do.

EXPERIENCED a DAY OF MIRACLES

If you have been on this email list for awhile, you will know that
we have been doing similar things to the movie for years. Praying
and baptizing people on the streets, etc. But I have to admit, when
I got back from the recent "Kickstart" with Torben in Australia,
something in me felt new and different. It was like a 'jump' had
taken place so that healings and other powerful things suddenly
felt more 'normal' and more attainable. And now we are teaching
others and they are seeing this "jump" take place in their own
lives. A jump into Book-of-Acts Christianity.

We just returned from a little town in Northland where some
brothers and I held a Training Weekend not too different from the
ones Torben holds. On Saturday we literally had an entire day
of healings, people getting filled with the Spirit and speaking in
'tongues', baptisms in the ocean - all interspersed with teaching
on the "Foundations" (Hebrews 6) - and so-on.

At one point we got all the "well" people to pray for all those with
injuries and sickness. Many were instantly healed. While this
was going on, I started praying for a woman who had had two
operations on her hips and walked in constant pain. As I
commanded healing in the name of JESUS she was instantly
healed and took off walking up and down the aisle to check that
the pain was gone. Totally healed in Jesus' name! I then asked
her if she had ever been filled with the Holy Spirit and spoken in
'tongues'. She never had. I laid on hands and prayed for her. She
was instantly filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in
a beautiful prayer-language. Honestly, I have never seen a person
look more radiant or filled-with-joy than this lady. And two hours
later she was helping to baptize a friend in the ocean. Real New
Testament stuff happening right before our eyes.

Did it used to be common for me to see powerful things happen
instantaneously like that? Nope. But now it is starting to become
truly "normal". And we also find that we are able to pass this on
to others. The gospel is being followed by healings and miracles,
just like it was in the Bible.

BAPTISM is AN ISSUE

Personally I have always been strong on baptism - both in water
and in the Spirit. The thing that I am strongest on is that baptism
should be done in FAITH. You need to BELIEVE that in baptism
God will do all the things He says He will do. Of course we insist
that people must repent first before they are baptized.

So when the Bible speaks of baptism as a "death and burial" of
the old life (Rom 6:3-4) we tell people to believe God for that. And
when it says that baptism is a "cutting off" (Col 2:11-12) and a
"washing away" (Acts 22:16) we tell people to believe God for
that. This makes baptism very powerful - just as it should be. Why
do we treat baptism as a mere "symbol" when if we do it in FAITH
it can be one of the most powerful spiritual experiences of a
person's entire life?

A lot of people ask questions about the way Torben baptizes.
You will notice in the movie that he says to the person, "I baptize
you into Jesus Christ" (or in the "name of Jesus Christ") but then
he does something additional while he is putting them under the
water. He says, "Die with Christ, rise with Christ." And he does
it every time. In fact, a lot of people get the impression that this
is Torben's baptismal formula. "Die with Christ, rise with Christ."

If you ask him, I'm sure Torben will say that this is just something
he adds to emphasize what baptism is all about. (Rom 6:3-4).
But the problem is that Torben's followers around the world are
copying him in a way that makes it seem like this is now the
proper "formula" for baptism. This could really cause problems.
In fact, it already is.

For many years I have personally baptized people "in the name
of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit - in the name of Jesus
Christ." Why do I do it this way? Because in Matt 28:19 it tells
us to baptize in the name of the "Father, Son and Holy Spirit"
but in the Book of Acts it tells us they baptized people in the
"name of Jesus Christ". So to fulfill all these Scriptures and also
to save confusion, I make sure that all of this is covered. To
speak the name of Jesus over someone being baptized is a very
wonderful thing.

So I have no problem with Torben baptizing people simply "into
the name of Jesus Christ." Personally I prefer to do it a bit
differently, but I have no problem with that at all. And neither do
I have a problem with people joining the 'Last Reformation'
movement. If they want to do that it is entirely up to them.

As for me and others, however, we consider that we are already
part of the "Jesus" movement. We love to take great material like
the 'Last Reformation' movie and show it to people to make them
inspired about doing the works of Jesus in the earth. It is one of
the best tools I know of to show that a "Book of Acts" lifestyle
truly is possible today. A very powerful film. But we do not have
to be part of a "movement" to do that.

I strongly encourage you to gather your friends and relations to
watch this movie. There is really nothing else like it. Maybe you
can even have a prayer and healing session afterward! Or a
baptism session! I'm sure it will inspire your friends just as it
has inspired many others.

TO COMMENT click here - http://www.revivalschool.com/

TO WATCH the MOVIE - thelastreformationmovie.com/

God bless you all.

Andrew Strom.